[ogb-discuss] Community Facilitators

[Jim Grisanzio]

Brandorr wrote:

> Personally I'm not sure what to think of this whole thing. Do we just
> stick the genie back in the bottle and call it a good try, or do we
> keep trying to figure out how we can open up more, and still get
> things done. 

We keep going. There is no going back. Besides, when we look back we can 
see just how far we've already come. The fact that we are having these 
conversations is extraordinary on many levels. A few years ago there was 
no OpenSolaris community, and pretty much every critic out there 
predicted our immediate death. We /are/ figuring this out. This is part 
of the process. Think much, much longer term.

> Some of us myself included need to realize that
> communications mistakes and oversights are not necessarily deliberate
> conspiratorial slights.

True. Most people around here are actually pretty genuine, but language 
is a really rough way to communicate. History has demonstrated this 
quite clearly.

> On the other side, all Sun individuals that are working on something
> that might be of value to the community must try to spend the extra 5%
> time to inform the community of what is happening. (If there is stuff
> being evaluated, then let us know, and let us know what criterion are
> being used.)

I agree. Aside from the core engineering and resource issues of moving 
development outside, I think we can open up our conversations more. It 
will not solve the lateness of opening some of this infrastructure, but 
I think it could help with the communication issues. This is one area 
where I think we underestimated the scope of this project internally. 
However, I also agree with Alan in that many people are outside, they've 
  been asking for help, the response has been lacking at times, and no 
one can know everything that is going on here.

> I have been told not to get my knickers in a bunch, as Indiana is a
> Sun internal project, 

It's supposed to be a community project. That's what we've been told. We 
need to work toward that goal.

> is all marketing, 

Oh, I see engineering working on it (packaging, modernization, install, 
etc) as well as marketing types. Heck, I'm even starting to do some 
stuff an I'm not an engineer or a marketeer. :)

> and I'd best steer clear, or I
> will burst a vein waiting for the community part. I didn't accept this
> input and am continuing to try and plod forward against the grain, and
> move many community building efforts forward.. (Building community is
> hard work, just as coding is. I'd argue that coding is a more
> enjoyable pasttime than community building, but you go where your
> conscience drives you.).

I see coding and community building as directly linked. You build 
community by actually working on stuff together. It may not be code, but 
some other thing, but getting together to build something /together/ is 
the single most power community development concept out there. That's 
what most companies miss with their developer "programs" they pitch.

  > As far as carping and sniping, you think we haven't seen our share,
> both here and at our day jobs? Welcome to the world of critics.... I
> mean Open source development.

I'm perfectly happy to get constructive criticism (and I've gotten a 
lot!). I think most people who want to grow feel the same way. The best 
constructive criticism on OpenSolaris has come from those who are 
directly involved and who are trying to participate in an honorable way. 
Their comments are absolutely heard internally (but many times, 
obviously, we can't do much to help .. that's the resources issue). 
However, I think we sometimes let a minority of people get away with 
pushing other people around. Alan is correct for calling them what they 
are. And the fact that he's doing it in such a remarkably quotable way 
is all the more entertaining. I totally support it.

> There is one thing I have to say to all of OpenSolaris's Sun members.
> For the most part this is one of the most welcoming, and friendly
> communities I've worked with. (Well for a large community that is).
> 
> People want to help you get your feet on the ground. And really help
> new folks. (As long as they don't ask "Stupid" "off-topic" questions.
> ;) (Just kidding, you guys seem to even have a tolerance for that).

Thank you. We appreciate that. Honestly.

And you should know that there are many people inside Sun who have 
believed in the OpenSolaris community from day one. Not only the concept 
of the community but the /individual people/ expressing ideas and 
contributing within the community. You should also know that the 
OpenSolaris project was controversial in its early days, and some people 
really went bat big time on behalf of the community.

> Hopefully this upcoming summit will enable both groups of contributors
> to understand and meet the individuals as people, rather than Sun
> piñatas and non-SUN piñatas.

I do think the summit will help some of these communication issues. We 
need an annual face-to-face meeting where people can sit down and talk 
and get to know each other in person. And drink.

Jim
-- 
Jim Grisanzio http://blogs.sun.com/jimgris